D0wn with Levi Strauss & C0.!

[CrAz3D]

My email:
[qu0te]C0mment: Earlier t0day I was reading an article,
http://www.atheists.0rg/flash.line/bsa1.htm, that menti0ns that Levi Strauss
has withdrawn sp0ns0rship 0f B0y Sc0uting.  I am w0ndering the validity 0f
this statement.

Thank y0u
[/qu0te]

Their resp0nse:
[qu0te]Hi Tyler:

Thank y0u f0r taking the time t0 c0ntact us.  We appreciate y0u taking the
time t0 send us y0ur c0mments.

LS&C0. has an established c0mmitment t0 n0ndiscriminati0n p0licies and
practices based 0n the c0mpany's c0re values and respect f0r individual
freed0ms.  In acc0rdance with this phil0s0phy, 0ur F0undati0n pr0vides
supp0rt t0 0rganizati0ns which d0 n0t discriminate 0n the basis 0f age,
p0litical affiliati0n, race, ethnicity, gender, disability, sexual
0rientati0n, 0r religi0us belief.

The B0y Sc0uts 0f America has c0nfirmed that their membership criteria is in
c0nflict with 0ur grant-making p0licies 0f n0ndiscriminati0n 0n the basis 0f
religi0us belief and sexual 0rientati0n.  Acc0rdingly, LS&C0. and the
F0undati0n can n0 l0nger fund the B0y Sc0uts 0f America.

We rec0gnize the valuable c0ntributi0ns B0y Sc0ut pr0grams have made t0
milli0ns 0f y0ung men.  It is n0t 0ur intenti0n 0r g0al t0 be punitive 0r t0
f0rce the B0y Sc0uts -- 0r any 0ther 0rganizati0n -- t0 change its p0licies
t0 c0mply with 0ur funding guidelines.  LS&C0. empl0yees are welc0me t0
v0lunteer their pers0nal time and res0urces t0 any 0rganizati0n they ch00se,
including the B0y Sc0uts 0f America.
Thank y0u 0nce again f0r c0ntacting us.  If y0u sh0uld need any additi0nal
assistance, please write back 0r call us at 1-800-USA-LEVI 0r visit
LeviStrauss.c0m.  0ur h0urs are M0nday thr0ugh Friday 6am - 4:30pm PST.

Be sure t0 als0 visit 0ur websites at levi.c0m, d0ckers.c0m, and
levistrausssignature.c0m where y0u can find 0ut up t0 date inf0rmati0n 0n
all 0f 0ur pr0ducts, as well as where y0u can purchase them.

Sincerely,

Charlyn
Levi Strauss & C0.
chafl02928346[/qu0te]


My Resp0nse:
[qu0te]But isn't LS&C0. discriminating against the B0y Sc0uts by dr0pping supp0rt 0f us because 0f 0ur beliefs.  The B0y Sc0uts deny membership t0 certain pe0ple because they d0 n0t meet 0ur m0ral standards.  Y0u rev0ked supp0rt because the B0y Sc0uts d0 n0t f0ll0w y0ur p0licies t0 receive supp0rt.  Is it really better t0 N0T supp0rt an 0rganizati0n that guides y0ung men int0 bec0ming respectable members 0f s0ciety than t0 withdraw the supp0rt because we d0 n0t believe in s0me pe0ple's way 0f life?  D0esn't that make LS&C0. a hyp0critical c0mpany?  D0es LS&C0. n0t want pr0ductive pe0ple in s0ciety?  W0uld LS&C0. rather have imm0ral pe0ple that missed 0ut 0n sc0uting because 0f lack 0f supp0rt fr0m c0rp0rati0n sp0ns0rs?  Did y0ur grant p0licies suddenly change that y0u had t0 dr0p supp0rt 0f near 5 milli0n y0ung men that are gr0wing pe0ple in the American s0ciety?

Get back t0 me when y0u get a chance.

[/qu0te]

[Hazard]

We recognize the valuable contributions Boy Scout programs have made to
millions of young men. 

Yea... lets name a few shall we? Famous Scouts:
Henry "Hank" Aaron
Neil Armstrong (Eagle Scout)
James Brady (Eagle Scout) -- Press Sec. for Ronald Reagan
Walter Cronkite
William C. DeVries, M.D., (Eagle Scout) -- Transplanted first artificial heart
Gerald Ford (Eagle Scout)
Harrison Ford
Bill Gates
John F. Kennedy
James Lovell
William McCool -- Space Shuttle Columbia Pilot
Jim Morrison -- Rock and Roll Legend
Ellison Onizuka -- Space Shuttle Challanger Astronaut
H. Ross Perot
Nolan Ryan
Steven Spielberg
Mark Spitz -- Best Olympic Swimmer of All-Time?
Wallace Stegner (Eagle Scout) -- Pulitzer Prizer Winning Author
Joe Theisman
J. Stephen Fossett
Donald H. Rumsfeld (Eagle Scout)
Jimmy Buffett
Sam Walton (Eagle Scout)

LS & Co. never objected to the BSA excluding females from the activities, only when the BSA ruled that gay leaders would not be tolerated did they get in a fit over it.

[CrAz3D]

BSA doesn't exclude females, women can join venture crews.  Venture crews are high adventure type co-ed groups that camp & whatnot alot

[dxoigmn]

Just for sake of argument, replace Boy Scouts of America with Ku Klux Klan. One can argue that the KKK isn't creating "respectable members of society" but I'm sure some people in the south would say that they are. Even so, your argument is flawed. The BSA is not the only organization that can spawn "respectable members of society" nor does one need to join the BSA to become a "respectable member of society" yet you use this kind of rhetoric that is easily dismissed.

[Adron]

Levi Strauss has made an admirable move in cutting support to an organization because it doesn't live up to basic non-discrimination standards, even though that organization is a large and old one. They have pointed a flash light at how discrimination still to this day permeates America, and even how some Americans run to defend discrimination.

[Hazard]

Adron, that is ridiculous. Would you want your son going to camp for a week with a gay adult leader? You can go ahead and pretend to be noble like you always do, but deep down we know you'd have a problem with that.

[dxoigmn]

Adron, that is ridiculous. Would you want your son going to camp for a week with a gay adult leader? You can go ahead and pretend to be noble like you always do, but deep down we know you'd have a problem with that.

Who cares that he's gay? Does that make him less of a man? Do his outdoor skills become null because he is gay? This is exactly the kind of thought that prevents society from progression. In my experience heterosexuals are more likely to force their way of life down one's throat than homosexuals. You know, I think you should become a psychic.  You have a way of predicting what people think, feel and believe. Although I don't know that you're good at it but what psychic is (re: John Edwards thread)?

[Adron]

Adron, that is ridiculous. Would you want your son going to camp for a week with a gay adult leader? You can go ahead and pretend to be noble like you always do, but deep down we know you'd have a problem with that.

Haha, would you want your son participating in any activity with a heterosexual female leader? We're not talking about allowing pedophiles to work with children...

[Forged]

Adron, that is ridiculous. Would you want your son going to camp for a week with a gay adult leader? You can go ahead and pretend to be noble like you always do, but deep down we know you'd have a problem with that.

I really couldn't care less.  Maybe if he was a pedophile, but just because someone is gay doesn't mean they are a pedophile.  I like women, that doesn't mean I would sleep with a 14 year old.

[Hazard]

Who cares that he's gay? Does that make him less of a man? Do his outdoor skills become null because he is gay? This is exactly the kind of thought that prevents society from progression. In my experience heterosexuals are more likely to force their way of life down one's throat than homosexuals. You know, I think you should become a psychic.  You have a way of predicting what people think, feel and believe. Although I don't know that you're good at it but what psychic is (re: John Edwards thread)?

This just shows that you're completely ignorant of scouting. The purpose of scouting is not to teach outdoor survival skills and camping, although that is a big part. The purpose of scouting is to build character and good morals. Homosexuality is not a moral position in the opinion of Boy Scouting. Its a club, of sorts. It simply requires that leaders be not known to be gay. Its exactly the same as it is in the military. Don't ask, don't tell, if we find out, you're gone. Do you think the military is taking the wrong approach as well? Its a membership requirement. You have to be a Battle.Net elitist in order to get into Valhalla Legends, but you won't make the argument that that is a bad position will you? Dxo, we know you want to be politically correct and all, but stop sucking up and kissing so much fag ass.

[Arta]

Why are gay people necessarily of bad character?

I think your argument is transparently homophobic.

[dxoigmn]

This just shows that you're completely ignorant of scouting. The purpose of scouting is not to teach outdoor survival skills and camping, although that is a big part. The purpose of scouting is to build character and good morals. Homosexuality is not a moral position in the opinion of Boy Scouting. Its a club, of sorts. It simply requires that leaders be not known to be gay.

Yes I am completely ignorant of the BSA because I mentioned two things and that obviously shows my breadth of knowledge about the BSA. Well if homosexuality is not a moral position then discrimination against homosexuals is not a moral position in the opinion of LS & Co and therefore will not fund the BSA. That's totally acceptable.

Its exactly the same as it is in the military. Don't ask, don't tell, if we find out, you're gone. Do you think the military is taking the wrong approach as well? Its a membership requirement.

Yes I do. Who cares if a guy is gay. As long as he doesn't affect morale or tries to put it down people's throat then there's no harm. What would you be so afraid of? Becoming gay?

[Hazard]

Putting a homosexual in that situation is asking for trouble. Its the same reason that adult men are not allowed to be unsupervised on Girl Scout outings, its covering all the bases before something terrible could happen.

[Arta]

Ridiculous, unfounded, paranoid, homophobic nonsense.

[Hazard]

Arta, its ridiculous. You'd think twice about it, deep down, you'd have a problem with it, and you know it. Stop taking the high and mighty approach of "Oh I know better," and face it.