Shooting in Miami

[CrAz3D]

You should also take into account the fact that the Iraqi Government has the ability to make the U.S. troops leave, all they have to do is ask.

They wouldn't risk offending us.

That doesn't they still can't

I believe most insurgents in iraq arae from syira (as i recall reading). iraqis have voted for/created their own president & constitution, 70%? of the iraqi population voted last time IIRC.

This is a extreme example, but look @ hitler. he got all the germans to kill the jews, was that right cause thats what they wanted? if hitler & germany had their way we'd ALLbe under the third reich

Only 70% wanted the constituation? Which means if there is (to pick a random number) 1,000,000 people living there, 300,000 didn't like it? That's a HUGE number!

And I don't recall, can you remind me about when the Jews took over Germany, or when the Jews rules Germany in an unjust way? I thought that's what we were talking about...

70% voted, not 70% voted for.  Anyway, that's still a 2/3 majority which is what is need in the US to pass a constitutional ammendment (just for comparission).

the Germans felt that the Jews were the cause of their hard times..so naturally if you remove the cause of a problem there ceases to be a problem.  The Germans being a soverign nation had the right, I guess according to you, to eliminate the problem/Jews.

[dxoigmn]

70% voted, not 70% voted for.  Anyway, that's still a 2/3 majority which is what is need in the US to pass a constitutional ammendment (just for comparission).

Umm... you need 2/3 majority of congress, and 3/4 majority of the states. If you consider the states being the people, then 70% would not be enough.

[CrAz3D]

k, had forgotten the states.  70% is quite close though.

[Grok]

Where does anyone say that 30% didn't want it? 30% of the people simply couldn't vote, chose not to vote or decided not to risk it. Nothing says the 30% of the people were against it.

Also, the American constitution doesn't apply in Iraq because Iraq isn't America. Its also vastly different from America vs. Britain because of the fact that in Iraq the Iraqis aren't former Americans. Rather funny how you're willing to support a cause for which innocent people are murdered yet you aren't brave enough to walk around a country that has guns.

You should also take into account the fact that the Iraqi Government has the ability to make the U.S. troops leave, all they have to do is ask.

The vote is so pathetically meaningless as long as the United States is occupying that country by force.

Anyone who opposes the installed government are insurgents, and subject to arrest, interrogation, and jail.  If you were an opposing Iraqi would you show up to "vote" at a polling place with hundreds of USA troops waiting to arrest you?

I find THIS particularly funny.  George Bush using this same argument in favor of the occupiers!

New Question:  Is it a mere coincidence that his name is George?  We sent the Declaration of Independence to King George because of his tyranny.  Is the solution to never elect someone named George?

[iago]

Also, the American constitution doesn't apply in Iraq because Iraq isn't America. Its also vastly different from America vs. Britain because of the fact that in Iraq the Iraqis aren't former Americans. Rather funny how you're willing to support a cause for which innocent people are murdered yet you aren't brave enough to walk around a country that has guns.

I thought the constitution represented universal principles?  Or do people not deserve the same rights outside your country?  Isn't it in the constitutio n (or something) that all men are created equal?  Or is that only true for American men?

You should also take into account the fact that the Iraqi Government has the ability to make the U.S. troops leave, all they have to do is ask.

I wonder what would happen if they tried that.... I rather doubt the US would listen. 

70% voted, not 70% voted for.  Anyway, that's still a 2/3 majority which is what is need in the US to pass a constitutional ammendment (just for comparission).

That's even worse.. so you don't even KNOW how 30% of the country feels? 

the Germans felt that the Jews were the cause of their hard times..so naturally if you remove the cause of a problem there ceases to be a problem.  The Germans being a soverign nation had the right, I guess according to you, to eliminate the problem/Jews.

I understand the holocaust totally differently than that.  I didn't know the Jews were ruling the Germans in an unjust way.  Could you find me a source explaining why the Germans were pissed off at how the Jews were ruling them?  Or, are you twisting my words to ridicule me?



Although CrAz3D for sure is too blind to see it, there are many parallels between the US trying to get its freedom from Britain and the Iraqis trying to get their freedom from the US.  The name "George" is obviously the strongest piece of evidence.  But yeah, the only real difference is that Iraq doesn't have the means to fight a war for their independence, the US is far too strong..

[CrAz3D]

Where does anyone say that 30% didn't want it? 30% of the people simply couldn't vote, chose not to vote or decided not to risk it. Nothing says the 30% of the people were against it.

Also, the American constitution doesn't apply in Iraq because Iraq isn't America. Its also vastly different from America vs. Britain because of the fact that in Iraq the Iraqis aren't former Americans. Rather funny how you're willing to support a cause for which innocent people are murdered yet you aren't brave enough to walk around a country that has guns.

You should also take into account the fact that the Iraqi Government has the ability to make the U.S. troops leave, all they have to do is ask.

The vote is so pathetically meaningless as long as the United States is occupying that country by force.

Anyone who opposes the installed government are insurgents, and subject to arrest, interrogation, and jail.  If you were an opposing Iraqi would you show up to "vote" at a polling place with hundreds of USA troops waiting to arrest you?

I find THIS particularly funny.  George Bush using this same argument in favor of the occupiers!

New Question:  Is it a mere coincidence that his name is George?  We sent the Declaration of Independence to King George because of his tyranny.  Is the solution to never elect someone named George?

George's should never be elected?  Say goodbye USA as our first president was a George.





30% of Iraq didn't vote in the last election.  Canada, in 2004, had the lowest voter turn out since 1898, 62% or so.  What did the other 38% of Canada want?  You're oppressing those poor innocent kanucks aren't you.

The Jews weren't ruling the Germans, but they were making problems for the Germans to complete their expansion.  "The First World War was a Jewish conspiracy, the Treaty of Versailles was a Jewish conspiracy, & finally the hyperinflation of 1932 was an international Jewish attempt to destroy Germany."  Looks like them Jews were mean to the Germans, maybe we shouldn't've stopped the Germans from doing what they wanted in their own country.

[Grok]

I was not very impressed with George Washington either.

[CrAz3D]

Of course not, he is only one of the main reasons we are here.  It was his growth as a leader that helped us through the war

[Invert]

I wrote a big thing to post but it's on my home computer; I will do that when I get home as a reply to some of this ludicrousness posted here.

I'm also glad that some people posting don't have their eyes shut and differentiate between wishful thinking and what really is happening.

The reason for this post is that I wanted to share this article by ABC News with some of the people screaming that the Iraqis are better off without the presence of the United States.

Here is an excerpt:

Average household incomes have soared by 60 percent in the last 20 months (to $263 a month), 70 percent of Iraqis rate their own economic situation positively, and consumer goods are sweeping the country. In early 2004, 6 percent of Iraqi households had cell phones; now it's 62 percent. Ownership of satellite dishes has nearly tripled, and many more families now own air conditioners (58 percent, up from 44 percent), cars, washing machines and kitchen appliances.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/PollVault/story?id=1389228

Edit: I forgot to post the link so here it is.

[CrAz3D]

Interesting info there

[Invert]

Of course not, he is only one of the main reasons we are here.  It was his growth as a leader that helped us through the war

I label Grok to be an Anti-American communist who is a traitor to a nation that gave him everything he has. Ask Grok when was the last time he paid his income taxes and then talk to him about sending people to jail that don't pay their bills. In China Grok would be shot for undermining his own country.

[Grok]

Of course not, he is only one of the main reasons we are here.  It was his growth as a leader that helped us through the war

I label Grok to be an Anti-American communist who is a traitor to a nation that gave him everything he has. Ask Grok when was the last time he paid his income taxes and then talk to him about sending people to jail that don't pay their bills. In China Grok would be shot for undermining his own country.

That's funny I view you to be the one full of blind hated of everything that America stands for, and myself to be the freedom loving defender of the United States Constitution.

As for your personal attacks, they have no place here, but I will tell you that I have always paid 100% of every tax dollar I owe by law, without any exceptions.

In a few years when you're less young and less ignorant, perhaps able to think more than you do now, you'll start using your own brain to comprehend what's going on around you.

I gave a full six years of my life in service of the United States Consitution as its sworn defender and I will DAMN WELL speak out on its behalf even if pipsqueaks like you would rather suppress such free speech.

Let's review what you have done for defense of the Consitution and the freedoms of what you supposedly believe in?

[Invert]

Of course not, he is only one of the main reasons we are here.  It was his growth as a leader that helped us through the war

I label Grok to be an Anti-American communist who is a traitor to a nation that gave him everything he has. Ask Grok when was the last time he paid his income taxes and then talk to him about sending people to jail that don't pay their bills. In China Grok would be shot for undermining his own country.

That's funny I view you to be the one full of blind hated of everything that America stands for, and myself to be the freedom loving defender of the United States Constitution.

As for your personal attacks, they have no place here, but I will tell you that I have always paid 100% of every tax dollar I owe by law, without any exceptions.

In a few years when you're less young and less ignorant, perhaps able to think more than you do now, you'll start using your own brain to comprehend what's going on around you.

I gave a full six years of my life in service of the United States Consitution as its sworn defender and I will DAMN WELL speak out on its behalf even if pipsqueaks like you would rather suppress such free speech.

Let's review what you have done for defense of the Consitution and the freedoms of what you supposedly believe in?

Hypocrite! You preach that there should not be personal attacks yet you call me ignorant a pipsqueak and imply that I am Anti-American.
Did you lie to me that you do not pay your income taxes?

I have served honorably in the Army defending your freedoms in a time of war receiving numerous awards for my meritorious service including the Army commendation medal and the Army Achievement Medal. I was in the infantry unlike you. I am the last person you can school here about serving my country.

You undermine the war effort and you undermine the United States and the people that protect the Constitution of the United States! To me those are clear signs of a traitor.

[Grok]

If anyone is a traitor is it you.

You have abandoned the United States Constitution and give blind loyalty where it does not belong.  The PEOPLE are the United States, and the government are our SERVANTS.  This is something which you seem to have no recognition of.

No, I have not lied to you at all.  Apparently however you comprehended absolutely ZERO of what I did convey to you.  So far you're batting 1.000 on failiure to understand simple concepts, and that includes the federal government of the United States as enumerated by the Constitution.  I've met a lot of cluefucks in my life and hope you're not just another one.  Wake up, READ the Constitution, STUDY what is happening to it and quite possibly, maybe, there will be hope for you desiring to serve freedom and the true American way of life.

Otherwise your rants sound more like McCarthyism than anything to be taken seriously.

[Invert]

If anyone is a traitor is it you.

You have abandoned the United States Constitution and give blind loyalty where it does not belong.  The PEOPLE are the United States, and the government are our SERVANTS.  This is something which you seem to have no recognition of.

No, I have not lied to you at all.  Apparently however you comprehended absolutely ZERO of what I did convey to you.  So far you're batting 1.000 on failiure to understand simple concepts, and that includes the federal government of the United States as enumerated by the Constitution.  I've met a lot of cluefucks in my life and hope you're not just another one.  Wake up, READ the Constitution, STUDY what is happening to it and quite possibly, maybe, there will be hope for you desiring to serve freedom and the true American way of life.

Otherwise your rants sound more like McCarthyism than anything to be taken seriously.

The only thing I am loyal to is the Constitution of the United States and the protectors of the Constitution. I know and understand that the government serves the people. We the people need to support the protection of the Constitution that gives us the freedoms we have. If we undermine the protection of the Constitution we will lose our freedoms.

I understand everything about volunteering taxes. Most Americans volunteer.

And your rents sound like Leninism.