Inauguration Day!

[quasi-modo]

A great number of you seem to think that 'traditions', 'values' and 'morals' are static, never-changing things. That would be an erroneous assumption.

But if you let your values and morals degrade your country becomes a cesspool

[Mephisto]

However, it's arguable to say that a lot of the moral values which we use to have are now out-dated.  Particuarily the involvement of Chrisitanity in such a ethnically diverse society (IMHO).  I also don't think gay people should be discriminated from being married have it legally binding; it's their choice, and it's not like it directly affects you, or causes anything *bad*.

[hismajesty]

Just because we have a few atheists, muslims, etc. doesn't mean the majority of the country isn't Christian. And, it's safe to say, every president we've ever had was religious and I think they were all Christian as well. So, obviously, they're going to lead with Christian values. If we had an atheist president (we never would) they'd obviously lead with non-Christian values. Well, actually, they'd probably stilll lead with looser Christian values since they'd have been brought up in a Government ruling with Christian values. America is a Christian nation, get over it.

[Arta]

Define cesspool? This whole values thing seems like a glib argument to me.

The things people seem to think and say about homosexual people now are rather similar to the things people used to say about black people and women in days gone by. I don't really see the difference. Who cares if gay people get married or not? How do their values effect yours?  All social change is resisted at first, because it goes against the status quo. Homophobia is one of the last accepted forms of prejudice in the western world - perhaps the last. It's time that was put right.

If America is about freedom, who are any of us to deny gay people the freedom to marry?

[quasi-modo]

cesspool:
   1. A covered hole or pit for receiving drainage or sewage, as from a house.
   2. A filthy, disgusting, or morally corrupt place.
according to dictionary.com

My use of it in this context: A society with rampant sex, violence, and drug use. All of these things are considered the norm due to a moral decay.

[Arta]

What's wrong with lots of (safe) sex?

[quasi-modo]

What's wrong with lots of (safe) sex?

Define safe sex? Sex with a strange woman and a condom might not be safe, but sex within wedlock with a woman you know would be.

Condom's can't stop all stds.

[Mephisto]

Why can't they if used properly?  I've never heard of an STD transmitted sexually which can get past a properly used condom which is designed to *be* a condom in a sexual situation (obviously by blood transfusion, sharing of needles, etc. but that has nothing to do with sex unless you're into that sort of thing while doing it...).

[quasi-modo]

Not all stds are like aids though where they move through fluids. You have genital warts, herpies, and other things which can be spread by the touching of skin in the genital region. Some can be cured, others cannot.

[hismajesty]

What's wrong with lots of (safe) sex?

Define safe sex? Sex with a strange woman and a condom might not be safe, but sex within wedlock with a woman you know would be.

Condom's can't stop all stds.

You should make it clear that, 'within wedlock', is referring to wedlock between a man and a woman.

[Arta]

So what? People get ill all the time. Someone coughs on you, you get a cold, you go to the doctor: what's the big deal?

The simple fact is that by following some very simple rules, sex can be made acceptably safe. In the unlikely event that you practice safe sex and still get something, go to a clinic and deal with it! There seems to be an implicit assumption in this debate that STDs are worse than other kinds of diseases, and I don't think that's necessarily true: especially when you consder that the worse STDs, like AIDS, Clamydia and soforth, are readily preventable by using a condom. Sure, you can get genital warts.. go swimming, you might get verrucas. Crabs? Lice. My point is, all of life entails risk, and the risk presented by safe sex is minimal.

I should make clear that I think random, unprotected promiscuity is very unwise and very dangerous, not to mention irresponsible, and I don't condone that at all.

On the larger point, assuming that you practice what you preach, what does it matter if a group of people totally unconnected to you do decide to have unsafe sex? How does it affect you?

[Mephisto]

Not all stds are like aids though where they move through fluids. You have genital warts, herpies, and other things which can be spread by the touching of skin in the genital region. Some can be cured, others cannot.

Ah, didn't know that.  Thanks for the info.  =)

[CrAz3D]

On the larger point, assuming that you practice what you preach, what does it matter if a group of people totally unconnected to you do decide to have unsafe sex? How does it affect you?

People that have unsafe sex & have low morals usu end up with 5-7 kids & cannot support these kids.  These kids grow up having a bad life, committing crimes, & wasting our tax money.

Also, the whole gay issue, my dad brought up a very good point a few months ago.  Don't get me wrong, he's against it but still...if they're gay isn't it their problem...we shouldn't judge, it isn't our right, God will judge them when the time comes.

[hismajesty]

So what? People get ill all the time. Someone coughs on you, you get a cold, you go to the doctor: what's the big deal?

The simple fact is that by following some very simple rules, sex can be made acceptably safe. In the unlikely event that you practice safe sex and still get something, go to a clinic and deal with it! There seems to be an implicit assumption in this debate that STDs are worse than other kinds of diseases, and I don't think that's necessarily true: especially when you consder that the worse STDs, like AIDS, Clamydia and soforth, are readily preventable by using a condom. Sure, you can get genital warts.. go swimming, you might get verrucas. Crabs? Lice. My point is, all of life entails risk, and the risk presented by safe sex is minimal.

I should make clear that I think random, unprotected promiscuity is very unwise and very dangerous, not to mention irresponsible, and I don't condone that at all.

On the larger point, assuming that you practice what you preach, what does it matter if a group of people totally unconnected to you do decide to have unsafe sex? How does it affect you?

Stop looking for something to argue about, this topic isn't about sex or STDs, it just happened to come up in an example.

[Arta]

This is supposed to be a place for debate, isn't it?