Supreme Court decision: refusal to produce ID

[Arta]

The Supreme Court just ruled (5-4 I think) that you can be arrested for refusing to provide ID when requested to by a police officer. In other words, they've ruled that refusal to provide ID constitutes probable cause for an arrest. Do you agree with this decision? I think I do. The petitioner's argument was that the arrest would violate the 4th/5th amendments.

You can read the opinion of the court, as well as dissenting opinions from Justices Breyer, Souter, Ginsburg, and Stevens here.

This site has some more information about the case.

Also cool: the DMCRA is being announced soon!

[iago]

What if you don't have id on you?  I agree totally that you should be able to produce id, even if they have to drive you to your house to get it, but forgetting your wallet at home shouldn't be an arrestable offense.

[muert0]

I don't own an ID.

Edit: I guess I should go get one before the SS picks me up.

[Hazard]

I think that its a wonderful idea. Calmy explaining that you don't have an ID is different than "Fuckin' pig why you pickin on a *n word-ah*man fuck you man I ain't got no fuckin' ID that shit ain't mine." If you say "No, you can't have it." I would say sure, go ahead and take them in I support that 100%!!

[Meh]

It wouldnt bother me. I carry an ID always cos i look younger than my age and i need it for lottery and occasionally movies.

[iago]

It wouldnt bother me. I carry an ID always cos i look younger than my age and i need it for lottery and occasionally movies.

I've been checked at a movie once, ever.  And I was old enough

I don't play lottery, or drink, or, most of the time, drive, but I still carry it with me just in case.

[Meh]

Ill do the lottery when theres rollovers or if im bored and have cash to spare. Im not a regular.

[Newby]

CNN article: http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/06/21/scotus.police.id/

[muert0]

It's just another step towards having no kind of privacy from the government. It sucks that most of you are saying it's cool for the police to just arrest you if you refuse to give them your name. If your just walking down the street not doing anything what gives them the right to know your name?

[Falcon[anti-yL]]

It's just another step towards having no kind of privacy from the government. It sucks that most of you are saying it's cool for the police to just arrest you if you refuse to give them your name. If your just walking down the street not doing anything what gives them the right to know your name?

Police don't just go around randomly asking for people's names. They only do it when you break the law like speeding or something.

[hismajesty]

It wouldnt bother me. I carry an ID always cos i look younger than my age and i need it for lottery and occasionally movies.

How old you have to be for the lottery there? I've never been checked at a movie. My friend and I went and bought tickets for the Tupac movie (I didn't want to go, but he did) and they didn't card us even though we were underage. The cops at the entrance to that theater did though.

Cops aren't allowed to randomly go up to somebody without probable cause.

[muert0]

Yeah, right. Cops are allowed to do whatever they want. And if you look a little different that usually gives them thier probable cause. Sorry if I'm being an ass today.

[MyndFyre]

Yeah, right. Cops are allowed to do whatever they want. And if you look a little different that usually gives them thier probable cause. Sorry if I'm being an ass today.

No, they're really not.  A Chandler, AZ police officer was arrested. lost his job, and is on trial still for the murder of a woman who tried to run him over while he was on his motorcycle.

Another two Phoenix police officers were arrested but found innocent when they shot a 19-year-old who started running at them with a knife.

[Stealth]

There are several levels of police interaction with people. I forget them specifically, but the earlier levels (I think the first is "contact") don't require a warrant or probable cause. It wouldn't make sense for a police officer to require a warrant to talk to you casually in line at a McDonald's.

The "contact" level of interaction doesn't require probable cause OR a warrant. It requires suspicion on the part of the officer - if you're acting suspiciously, they can ask you for your name and see if you have perhaps a criminal record that might indicate you're doing something other than being a nice, law-abiding member of society. Even if you have a criminal record, and they scan your name in their database, they STILL CAN'T ARREST YOU until you do something wrong.

To me, this seems reasonable. Sure, it's not privacy paradise, but I think something is wrong when people freely distribute their names on the Internet for millions of people to see, but won't even tell them to a local police officer who probably has nothing on them anyways.

Edit: I was wrong about that. Still, if you don't carry ID and are asked for it - police officers are reasonable people. Just give your name and explain that you don't carry your ID for whatever reason. They're not going to arrest you on the spot because you don't carry ID.

[MyndFyre]

There are several levels of police interaction with people. I forget them specifically, but the earlier levels (I think the first is "contact") don't require a warrant or probable cause. It wouldn't make sense for a police officer to require a warrant to talk to you casually in line at a McDonald's.

The "contact" level of interaction doesn't require probable cause OR a warrant. It requires suspicion on the part of the officer - if you're acting suspiciously, they can ask you for your name and see if you have perhaps a criminal record that might indicate you're doing something other than being a nice, law-abiding member of society. Even if you have a criminal record, and they scan your name in their database, they STILL CAN'T ARREST YOU until you do something wrong.

To me, this seems reasonable. Sure, it's not privacy paradise, but I think something is wrong when people freely distribute their names on the Internet for millions of people to see, but won't even tell them to a local police officer who probably has nothing on them anyways.

Edit: I was wrong about that. Still, if you don't carry ID and are asked for it - police officers are reasonable people. Just give your name and explain that you don't carry your ID for whatever reason. They're not going to arrest you on the spot because you don't carry ID.

Remember also, that when you're talking to a police officer (for example, during the "contact" level), what you say can't be used against you in court.  There are specific rights enumerated by the Miranda decision (hence your Miranda rights), which is why you are read a warning prior to your arrest.