Religion

[FrOzeN]

I've noticed alot of topics about Islam etc, so I thought I'd just bring up this one question to see what your opinions are on it.

With Christianity, IIRC in order to get into heaven you must have like a 'perfect record', eg, have had all your sins forgiven. Because it's impossible (don't get technical) to live life perfectly without any flaws or breaching anything God has ever said. Along came Jesus who died for us, so you could be baptized and take his 'perfect record' in order to get into heaven (aswell as getting your sins forgiven).

My though was, say you lived a good life, being decent, worked hard, gave generously to charity, didn't break any laws except for maybe one speeding ticket or parking fine, never really lied excluding the odd white lie here and there and overall was a good human being. When you supposively had to face God to be judged. Would he just disband all this goodness you've done and send you to Hell just because you (didn't believe in him / have your sins forgiven)?

[quasi-modo]

I've noticed alot of topics about Islam etc, so I thought I'd just bring up this one question to see what your opinions are on it.

With Christianity, IIRC in order to get into heaven you must have like a 'perfect record', eg, have had all your sins forgiven. Because it's impossible (don't get technical) to live life perfectly without any flaws or breaching anything God has ever said. Along came Jesus who died for us, so you could be baptized and take his 'perfect record' in order to get into heaven (aswell as getting your sins forgiven).

My though was, say you lived a good life, being decent, worked hard, gave generously to charity, didn't break any laws except for maybe one speeding ticket or parking fine, never really lied excluding the odd white lie here and there and overall was a good human being. When you supposively had to face God to be judged. Would he just disband all this goodness you've done and send you to Hell just because you (didn't believe in him / have your sins forgiven)?

Yes/No because there is no 'good person'. We are all born into sin and all have a sinning nature. We are all the seed of Adam and we all inherit the sins of the flesh. We all are greedy, we all lust, we all are jealous of someone else, we all have mortal sins that we inherit. Yes we should try to live perfectly, we should strive to be like christ, but we have already failed at that, that is why we need His payment for our sins. So this person is basically a good guy, he didnt kill anyone, wasnt a scum bag. But still he had a choice, to accept or reject Christ. If he stands before God and his name isn't in the book of life, if Christ hasn't made the payment for his sins, that means he chose to reject Christ so therefore he will be judged based on his sins.

[topaz]

I've noticed alot of topics about Islam etc, so I thought I'd just bring up this one question to see what your opinions are on it.

With Christianity, IIRC in order to get into heaven you must have like a 'perfect record', eg, have had all your sins forgiven. Because it's impossible (don't get technical) to live life perfectly without any flaws or breaching anything God has ever said. Along came Jesus who died for us, so you could be baptized and take his 'perfect record' in order to get into heaven (aswell as getting your sins forgiven).

My though was, say you lived a good life, being decent, worked hard, gave generously to charity, didn't break any laws except for maybe one speeding ticket or parking fine, never really lied excluding the odd white lie here and there and overall was a good human being. When you supposively had to face God to be judged. Would he just disband all this goodness you've done and send you to Hell just because you (didn't believe in him / have your sins forgiven)?

You're such an idiot... the only requirement to get into Heaven is to believe Jesus is your redeemer and ask for salvation. You cannot, under your own power, get into Heaven. That's why it's known as 'God's grace'. Learn a couple things before you make stupid posts.

[Joe[x86]]

I've noticed alot of topics about Islam etc, so I thought I'd just bring up this one question to see what your opinions are on it.

With Christianity, IIRC in order to get into heaven you must have like a 'perfect record', eg, have had all your sins forgiven. Because it's impossible (don't get technical) to live life perfectly without any flaws or breaching anything God has ever said. Along came Jesus who died for us, so you could be baptized and take his 'perfect record' in order to get into heaven (aswell as getting your sins forgiven).

My though was, say you lived a good life, being decent, worked hard, gave generously to charity, didn't break any laws except for maybe one speeding ticket or parking fine, never really lied excluding the odd white lie here and there and overall was a good human being. When you supposively had to face God to be judged. Would he just disband all this goodness you've done and send you to Hell just because you (didn't believe in him / have your sins forgiven)?

Blaspheming Jesus is a sin, therefore believing that you can be perfect like him is a sin, thus you've sinned and aren't perfect. So in short, no.

[Yegg]

I've noticed alot of topics about Islam etc, so I thought I'd just bring up this one question to see what your opinions are on it.

With Christianity, IIRC in order to get into heaven you must have like a 'perfect record', eg, have had all your sins forgiven. Because it's impossible (don't get technical) to live life perfectly without any flaws or breaching anything God has ever said. Along came Jesus who died for us, so you could be baptized and take his 'perfect record' in order to get into heaven (aswell as getting your sins forgiven).

My though was, say you lived a good life, being decent, worked hard, gave generously to charity, didn't break any laws except for maybe one speeding ticket or parking fine, never really lied excluding the odd white lie here and there and overall was a good human being. When you supposively had to face God to be judged. Would he just disband all this goodness you've done and send you to Hell just because you (didn't believe in him / have your sins forgiven)?

You're such an idiot... the only requirement to get into Heaven is to believe Jesus is your redeemer and ask for salvation. You cannot, under your own power, get into Heaven. That's why it's known as 'God's grace'. Learn a couple things before you make stupid posts.

You're a damn moron. You say "requirement" as if getting into Heaven is like getting into the military. He's correct in saying what he said. A typically "good person" can get into Heaven, even if they denied his existence. Denying his existence isn't the same as condemning what he stands for. Someone who does good deeds, is friendly, doesn't have some secret, evil life, and respects beliefs or opinions of others is good enough to get into Heaven. However, not immeditaely.

To be flushed off all your sin, you are sent to Purgatory. This is like a temporary prison/waiting room. In this place you are to undergo a form of pain and you are to be taught to love Jesus. Depending on the "weight" of the sin you carried, your time being there can vary. You could be there for thousands of years, or you could be there for a year. Note that these "years" are the only way we can comprehend it as humans. Remember that the universe does not know what time is. Time is imaginary, us humans created it, it is only in our minds.

Also, a person can get into Heaven without Purgatory. Children, the mentally handicapped, and exceptional individuals. Children (includes babies or infants) do not know right from wrong, so they are sent straight to Heaven. The mentally handicapped also do not know right from wrong, so they too are sent straight to Heaven. "exceptional individuals" includes those who lived such holy lives that they were good enough to be received into Heaven without first having to wait in Purgatory until their souls were ready. People such as Pope John Paul II and Mother Teresa. These two for example would have gone straight to Heaven. Us regular people probably would not be able to find a single sin from them. However, they must have sinned because they are human, and they were born with original sin. They also did go to confession, I cant begin to imagine what sort of sins they could have had with them, but there must have been a few.

I hope this clears things up for you guys.

Blaspheming Jesus is a sin, therefore believing that you can be perfect like him is a sin, thus you've sinned and aren't perfect. So in short, no.

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus wants us to be "perfect". He actually said that while on Earth. He said that he wanted us to be perfect, not that we can, and he knows this, but he wants us to try. We should try to be perfect, to try to be perfect you must believe you can be perfect. Doing so is not a sin.

[Joe[x86]]

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus wants us to be "perfect". He actually said that while on Earth. He said that he wanted us to be perfect, not that we can, and he knows this, but he wants us to try. We should try to be perfect, to try to be perfect you must believe you can be perfect. Doing so is not a sin.

I was saying that thinking you don't need Jesus, that you can be perfect on your own, is false.

[Yegg]

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus wants us to be "perfect". He actually said that while on Earth. He said that he wanted us to be perfect, not that we can, and he knows this, but he wants us to try. We should try to be perfect, to try to be perfect you must believe you can be perfect. Doing so is not a sin.

I was saying that thinking you don't need Jesus, that you can be perfect on your own, is false.

I see what you mean now. You should have worded it where you said that if you blasphemed Jesus and then thought that you could be perfect like him is a sin, that would be true. To me, I saw it as "Blaspheming Jesus is a sin, it's also a sin if you believe you can be perfect like him".

[Explicit]

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus wants us to be "perfect". He actually said that while on Earth. He said that he wanted us to be perfect, not that we can, and he knows this, but he wants us to try. We should try to be perfect, to try to be perfect you must believe you can be perfect. Doing so is not a sin.

I was saying that thinking you don't need Jesus, that you can be perfect on your own, is false.

Purely subjective.

[topaz]

You're a damn moron. You say "requirement" as if getting into Heaven is like getting into the military. He's correct in saying what he said. A typically "good person" can get into Heaven, even if they denied his existence. Denying his existence isn't the same as condemning what he stands for. Someone who does good deeds, is friendly, doesn't have some secret, evil life, and respects beliefs or opinions of others is good enough to get into Heaven. However, not immeditaely.

We're talking about Christianity, not whatever it is you happen to believe in. You must confess your sins to gain entry to Heaven - period.

To be flushed off all your sin, you are sent to Purgatory. This is like a temporary prison/waiting room. In this place you are to undergo a form of pain and you are to be taught to love Jesus. Depending on the "weight" of the sin you carried, your time being there can vary. You could be there for thousands of years, or you could be there for a year. Note that these "years" are the only way we can comprehend it as humans. Remember that the universe does not know what time is. Time is imaginary, us humans created it, it is only in our minds.

We're not discussing Dante literature here, and you've pulled most of that shit out of your ass.

Also, a person can get into Heaven without Purgatory. Children, the mentally handicapped, and exceptional individuals. Children (includes babies or infants) do not know right from wrong, so they are sent straight to Heaven. The mentally handicapped also do not know right from wrong, so they too are sent straight to Heaven. "exceptional individuals" includes those who lived such holy lives that they were good enough to be received into Heaven without first having to wait in Purgatory until their souls were ready. People such as Pope John Paul II and Mother Teresa. These two for example would have gone straight to Heaven. Us regular people probably would not be able to find a single sin from them. However, they must have sinned because they are human, and they were born with original sin. They also did go to confession, I cant begin to imagine what sort of sins they could have had with them, but there must have been a few.

The Bible isn't specific as to how those special cases are handled, but God is full of mercy and justice. Quit pulling shit out of your ass as if you know how it works.

I hope this clears things up for you guys.

It creates more questions, such as: Why are you such an idiot?

What the hell are you talking about? Jesus wants us to be "perfect". He actually said that while on Earth. He said that he wanted us to be perfect, not that we can, and he knows this, but he wants us to try. We should try to be perfect, to try to be perfect you must believe you can be perfect. Doing so is not a sin.

I think "perfect" is in reference to character...

[Yegg]

We're talking about Christianity, not whatever it is you happen to believe in. You must confess your sins to gain entry to Heaven - period.

Your sins are "confessed", actually clensed, during your time in Purgatory.

The Bible isn't specific as to how those special cases are handled, but God is full of mercy and justice. Quit pulling shit out of your ass as if you know how it works.

That is taught by the Roman Catholic Church. Is the Roman Catholic Church an "ass" in your eyes? It seems so.

It creates more questions, such as: Why are you such an idiot?

Calling me an idiot because you refuse to believe my information doesn't look too good for you, moron.

P.S. Stop talking about "shit" and "ass"'s. 

[topaz]

I don't refuse to believe your information - rather, you're attempting to refute my arguments with data FROM ANOTHER DENOMINATION.

[Yegg]

I don't refuse to believe your information - rather, you're attempting to refute my arguments with data FROM ANOTHER DENOMINATION.

Do you not realize there are many Christian denominations? Catholicism is based off Christianity. Frozen said "With Christianity", he never mentioned a specific denomination. I gave information based on one of the Christian denominations. There is no set "standard" for such a topic that would be followed by all Christian denomination.

Different beliefs for different religions (denominations in this case).

[topaz]

Well, gee, when you say only 'Christianity', you're referring to the main sect. You wouldn't talk about catholic beliefs while saying they were Christian, now would you?

[FrOzeN]

You're such an idiot... the only requirement to get into Heaven is to believe Jesus is your redeemer and ask for salvation. You cannot, under your own power, get into Heaven. That's why it's known as 'God's grace'. Learn a couple things before you make stupid posts.

First, I'm atheist. So far the more and more I learn about religion, the more like a fairy tale is seems. I specifically put 'perfect record' in apostrophe's as I couldn't remember the correct terminology for it. And I assumed you guys would pick that up.

I'll reiterate my question in another form, as it seems the other one is too confusing for you to comphrehend in the colloquial form I expressed it.

First by christianity, this time I'm referring to those who follow the guidelines/(rules?) set by The Bible and Jesus.

The way I've always heard it was, "To get into heaven you must not sin.", because this is impossible for Humans along came Jesus. He lived life helping others, never sinning and then died for us. He died for us, so we can accept him to become our saviour which allows us to revoke our sins. Then furthermore as we continue to sin (whilst trying to be perfect) they become revoked by being under Jesus's salvation as we continue to pray etc..

---

What I was wondering, if you didn't believe in God and as said before lived life without intending to do anything bad despite small hiccups time to time, aswell as being helpful to those amoung you etc.. When faced on judgement day (?) and he decides whether you go to Heaven on not. Will he say "No, because you didn't accept Jesus as your saviour to have your sins revoked."? or are other there other varibles here that I'm missing?

[topaz]

You're such an idiot... the only requirement to get into Heaven is to believe Jesus is your redeemer and ask for salvation. You cannot, under your own power, get into Heaven. That's why it's known as 'God's grace'. Learn a couple things before you make stupid posts.

First, I'm atheist. So far the more and more I learn about religion, the more like a fairy tale is seems. I specifically put 'perfect record' in apostrophe's as I couldn't remember the correct terminology for it. And I assumed you guys would pick that up.

If you think 2.1 billion people around the world believe in a fairytale, then you either 1) Don't give humanity enough credit, or 2) you're too full of yourself to see that you're not as intelligent as you think you are. (Source)

The way I've always heard it was, "To get into heaven you must not sin.", because this is impossible for Humans along came Jesus. He lived life helping others, never sinning and then died for us. He died for us, so we can accept him to become our saviour which allows us to revoke our sins. Then furthermore as we continue to sin (whilst trying to be perfect) they become revoked by being under Jesus's salvation as we continue to pray etc..

You should go to church more often, because that clearly isn't the case.

What I was wondering, if you didn't believe in God and as said before lived life without intending to do anything bad despite small hiccups time to time, aswell as being helpful to those amoung you etc.. When faced on judgement day (?) and he decides whether you go to Heaven on not. Will he say "No, because you didn't accept Jesus as your saviour to have your sins revoked."? or are other there other varibles here that I'm missing?

Wrong again. All of mankind has sinned, and only when you accept Jesus as your savior and ask for forgiveness will you be saved and go to Heaven.