Speed? whats fastest?

[Skywing]

$t0rm/hismajesty-

I'm getting paid to write C and C++ right now, actually.  Dunno where this myth that nobody gets paid for writing stuff other than Java/C# started from, but it doesn't seem to really hold true.

Much easier to find a web job in a hip language than a C++ one, IMO.

I suppose.  I'm not doing a 'web job', though, really.

Windows 3.x and Win9x were written in assembler.

How much of them were? Writing an entire OS the size of windows in assembler doesn't sound very sensible!

The vast majority, AFAIK.  It was very sensible when your target machines had 4MB of RAM or less...

Proof of this can be found in that it was Win9x that really took off, and not NT (until relatively recently).

NT was written in C and not assembler, and far predated Win9x.  Of course, you also had to have more hardware than the typical consumer desktop had to run it decently (compared to Win9x or Win3.1).

[Banana fanna fo fanna]

$t0rm/hismajesty-

I'm getting paid to write C and C++ right now, actually.  Dunno where this myth that nobody gets paid for writing stuff other than Java/C# started from, but it doesn't seem to really hold true.

Much easier to find a web job in a hip language than a C++ one, IMO.

I suppose.  I'm not doing a 'web job', though, really.

Whoops...looks like the lexer had an ambiguous match error.

Much easier to find (a web job in a hip language) than (a C++ one), IMO.

[Skywing]

$t0rm/hismajesty-

I'm getting paid to write C and C++ right now, actually.  Dunno where this myth that nobody gets paid for writing stuff other than Java/C# started from, but it doesn't seem to really hold true.

Much easier to find a web job in a hip language than a C++ one, IMO.

I suppose.  I'm not doing a 'web job', though, really.

Whoops...looks like the lexer had an ambiguous match error.

Much easier to find (a web job in a hip language) than (a C++ one), IMO.

Ah.  Well, in my case it was easier to find a C++ job.  Your experiences may vary, though.

[FrOzeN]

ok i'm just gonna start learning C/C# once i get the hang of them and start understanding socks i'll move into C++ as i eventually want to create my own game..

thanx for all the help  

[Banana fanna fo fanna]

not c/c#

it's java/C# and c/c++

[hismajesty]

I'm not sure where you get that most of the things Microsoft writes are in C#.

NT, Office, VS/CL (for the most part, excepting some of the IDE -- the compiler/linker is the important part anyway), etc are C or C++.

Windows 3.x and Win9x were written in assembler.

I think that covers enough things not C# or VB.NET...

Windows 3.x/9x were written before .NET was even released, I meant in present time. And I got that information in an email Robert Scoble (developer at Microsoft) wrote me. I'll get the quote:

Yeah, in the past I'd assume most of the apps were done in C/C++. That's
changing very quickly to C#/.NET. Drivers and games and key things that
need high performance are the two big exceptions. Yeah, some
internal business apps (expense report kinds of things) were written in VB.

I'm getting paid to write C and C++ right now, actually.  Dunno where this myth that nobody gets paid for writing stuff other than Java/C# started from, but it doesn't seem to really hold true.

Nobody said that C/C++ was obsolete. I was speaking from where the world in general is moving, which is to .NET. Microsoft is developing in C# more and more. Which is where I mainly based that opinion, along with iago telling me the percentage of languages being requested in his area.

[Grok]

There is another way to look at this.  What has industry done in the past when there were major language usage shifts?  To answer that, you can look at COBOL and Visual Basic., as compared to C/Ada/C++.

There is always a large segment of industry, especially business applications, that will be using a low performance, easy-to-write-in language appropriate for those tasks.  Business processes are dynamic, they change with the shifting requirements of business.  They need a development shop that can rapidly, and I stress rapidly, design code and deploy new applications.  That was never going to happen with C/Ada/C++ for the majority of uses.  Those types of needs are what gave COBOL, and later Visual Basic, their market strength and fortitude.

Now along comes Java, which excelled at RAD, was great for mid-sized to large corporations, but not so much the smaller ones that had to scrape the barrel bottom for programming skills.  Many mid to large companies went to Java, but equally as many programmers were doing VB now, and you still had legions of older guys (who are all 55+ now) supporting COBOL programs written in the 70s and early 80s.

By looking at the history, you can probably predict what will happen with .NET, mainly, pretty much the same things.  It will find its niche.  Nobody will be doing everything in .NET and .NET will not solve all problems.  It will likely replace up to a third of Java installations, but might drive away businesses that were previously using VB6.  Maybe those guys don't understand FCL or CLR and their whole little shops move to Java.

[MyndFyre]

Very interesting point, although -- if you can understand Java and the Java Class Library, then you can understand C# and the FCL.  Programs that can be written in Java can be written generally in C# with just a few identifier changes, and then if you understand C#, they can often be made more robust rather quickly.

The first time I had to write a doubly-linked list in Java, I spent a few hours on it, couldn't get it to work correctly.  Restarted in C#, had it working in 10 minutes,  spent 5 minutes converting back to Java, and it worked fine.

How similar those two languages are is retarded, but... it's a fact of life I guess.  :/

[Falcon[anti-yL]]

Yea I think Java is being used more now as they just switched from teaching C++ to Java in my Computer Science class this year.

[hismajesty]

Yea I think Java is being used more now as they just switched from teaching C++ to Java in my Computer Science class this year.

In most (all?) schools. It was a decision by the college board to switch the AP test from C++ to Java. However, my schools intro to programming class (who doesn't even get to use computers for a good part of the year...) is in C++. The curiculum is a joke though, the AP Comp Sci teacher gave me a sylabus for the class since I'm taking it this year. I covered the entire thing in 4 hours with one of my Java books. They don't get into Swing or anything like that, and spend 3 weeks on things such as if statements, but only one week on OOP.

[Grok]

The curiculum is a joke though, the AP Comp Sci teacher gave me a sylabus for the class since I'm taking it this year. I covered the entire thing in 4 hours with one of my Java books. They don't get into Swing or anything like that, and spend 3 weeks on things such as if statements, but only one week on OOP.

Most high school, and some college, compsci teachers either do not understand OOP, or do not understand it well enough to teach it.  They struggle with ways to describe the concepts.  Sometimes their problem is the students inability to conceptualize and abstract.

[Maddox]

We don't even have a CS class offered in our entire district.

[Banana fanna fo fanna]

we did flash last year for compsci.
i admit, i did learn it!

[Maddox]

I think I am going to take the AP CS test even though I am not taking the class. I bet I could get at least   a 4 on it without studying.

[Maddox]

Anyways, getting back to speed.