Valhalla Legends Archive

It doesn't have a personal effect on you, then you go on about "I", "I", "I", "I" ... hmm.

I'm not allowed to kill somebody.

Just because it has potential to affect me, doesn't mean it does.  IF I went to the United States, and IF I wanted to drink, it would affect me, but I won't, and I don't, so it won't.  

It just seems silly that I can be legally licensed to sell it here, and to decide who gets it and who doesn't here, but down there I can't even buy it.  Silly Americans!!

Quote from: iago on December 14, 2003, 04:29 PM
It just seems silly that I can be legally licensed to sell it here, and to decide who gets it and who doesn't here, but down there I can't even buy it.  Silly Americans!!

It's different goals. Perhaps in America they want a 98% probability of a person being mature before they sell alcohol to him, while in Canada, they settle for a 95% probability? It's also possible that an average over many Americans will show that they reach the same maturity level at 20 as Canadians do at 18?

It's much lower than 98% and 95%.  People at this age are very immature.  To be safe, and have a reasonable chance of maturity, they should make it 28 or 30.  A lot of people aren't mature at 20..you find that out working at a vendor

Quote from: iago on December 15, 2003, 03:13 PM
It's much lower than 98% and 95%.  People at this age are very immature.  To be safe, and have a reasonable chance of maturity, they should make it 28 or 30.  A lot of people aren't mature at 20..you find that out working at a vendor

You mean, a lot of the people that you see coming to the vendor.

I am 20, Fully independant, Reasonable beleif to have a promising future... I know tons of people who are terribly immature and irresponcible, but I also know several people who are intelligent/mature/responcible. Coincidentally I don't think any of them would smoke weed anymore despite wether it was legal or not... On that same note I'm sure if it were legal and cheap my 48(Maybe?) year old dad probably would(Even without the legalness I am sure) but well... You learn its full effects when you're much younger then 18 even and have plenty of years to let them sink in and come to conclusions as to if it is something you will or will not do. So having a legal age for it is just totally irrelevant? In short you would basically the same thing as alot of kids do now for cigarettes, slip a stranger twice as much as their worth and have them go buy it for you.

Quote from: Skywing on December 15, 2003, 03:59 PM

Quote from: iago on December 15, 2003, 03:13 PM
It's much lower than 98% and 95%.  People at this age are very immature.  To be safe, and have a reasonable chance of maturity, they should make it 28 or 30.  A lot of people aren't mature at 20..you find that out working at a vendor

You mean, a lot of the people that you see coming to the vendor.

You're right, actually, a vendor isn't an accurate cross-section of society.

Quote from: Hostile on December 15, 2003, 04:15 PM
So having a legal age for it is just totally irrelevant?

It's not irrelevant. If nothing else, it keeps it out of the hands of the 6-year-olds.

Obviously, in theory it would be atleast 18 or 21 and well~ ok? 6 yr olds wouldn't be the ones going for it... 13+ yr olds would be the one going for it and they would get it even easier then before.

I wouldn't be so sure... Think about it for a while - if candy shops were allowed to sell alcohol to small children, don't you think they would try, just to make money?

Quote from: Adron on December 16, 2003, 04:20 PM
I wouldn't be so sure... Think about it for a while - if candy shops were allowed to sell alcohol to small children, don't you think they would try, just to make money?

They'd do it just for fun.  That's usually worth more than the money you could make from a 6 year old.

it should be left up to the parents

[yeah, bad idea ]

Quote from: iago on December 16, 2003, 06:18 PM
it should be left up to the parents

[yeah, bad idea ]

Actually, that's the common sense idea and probably works best.  When I was in Anatalya, Turkey, some friends and myself were sitting at a restaurant on the docks by the Mediterranean, while at the next table a family was doing the same, eating dinner and drinking wine and beer.  Their boy of about 8-9 years old, I guess, would occasionally drink from his parents glass.  We just laughed, knowing that in the USA, the good old free USA, people would flip out seeing that.  They'd be calling social services, the police, sirens would go off, judges would be brought in, people's lives destroyed, and lawyers would make a lot of money.  But in Turkey, that day, the kid took a drink, put the glass back on the table, and continued playing with his balloon.  He came over to our table and hit David Simonis on the head with the balloon and started laughing.  David Thorsvik said "See Dave, kids all over the world hate you!"

Point is, let parents raise kids.  They'll do a hella better job than governments.

That's probably true.  Laws and police aren't going to stop kids from drinking, smoking, or doing any kind of illicit drugs, but parental influence, likely, will.  I think that's the main reason I've been "good" all my life, not because it's legal.  

Smoking weed/doing any other illicit drugs is a bad idea, I think we can agree on that.  But it's not the government's responsiblity to make sure we don't hurt ourselves, I think we can all agree on that, too, judging by this thread.  It is, however, our parents responsibility (I like to think) to make sure that we don't hurt ourselves, that's what they're there for.

Can we agree on that?

Not completely. It's the governments responsibility to not rob the parents of the means to prevent their children from hurting themselves. This means giving the parents legal rights over their children, and conversely not giving the children all the legal rights of an adult on their own.