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Web development platform

Started by Banana fanna fo fanna, July 13, 2004, 11:30 PM

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What do you use for web development?

ASP classic
1 (4%)
ASP.NET - any language
4 (16%)
Perl/Python/CGI
2 (8%)
C/C++
1 (4%)
PHP
14 (56%)
Java (JSP or Servlets)
1 (4%)
ColdFusion
1 (4%)
Other
1 (4%)

Total Members Voted: 19

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MyndFyre

#15
July 15, 2004, 06:10 PM
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
I want to be able to:
- Use a general site template
This is why I recommend looking at ASP.NET 2.0.  I get a hard-on looking at Master Pages:
MSDN Magazine June 2004: Master Pages
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
- Include specific pods/pagelets/modules whatever, not just a plain include file, but give it parameters, have caching, etc
Personalize the look to your user (even changing your Master Page if you hook into the right event -- the PreInit event).  MSDN Magazine June 2004: Web Parts and Personalization
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
- Decouple me from the graphic designer
Like I told you on AIM, the designer does an extremely well job if your graphic designer gives you something of a template to start off with.  Of course, if you're using Master Pages, you definitely don't need to worry about it -- your graphic designer will worry strictly about the Master Page.  But, the AoA Website (that I haven't kept updated) was done in the ASP.NET 1.0 system.  I got the template from a friend who made it in ImageReady and Photoshop.  I just plugged in the rest.
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
- Use OOP
ASP.NET is all OOP.  If you don't OOP it you're crazy.
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
- Write an event-driven website, similar to the Mach-II system
I'm not too sure about what the Mach-II system is or does, but ASP.NET is solid on event-driven programming.  The page-postbacks are handled superbly, and with ASP.NET 2.0, you can post-back without making the page refresh using an ActiveX control (which is built-in to the Script Callbacks feature).
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
- Database caching and decoupling
As I understand it, ADO.NET is a completely decoupled system of using databases.  Essentially, you load your database, do your database functions on the data in-memory, cached, and then when you're idle and it's convenient, you write a bunch of transactions back to the database at once, making for a disconnected model.
Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
How does ASP.NET work for me?

Here's a summary of the features: MSDN Magazine June 2004: An Overview of the New Services, Controls, and Features in ASP.NET 2.0.

If you have the ability to use Beta in production (which I understand many sites did during the beta of ASP.NET 1.0), I would go with it.  I'm downloading Visual Studio 2005 at the moment at home, and I'm going to install it on my laptop, where I do all my development (along with Longhorn PDC 2004!!!).  So, if you have access to it, I would definitely check it out.  It may just be worth your while.  :)
QuoteEvery generation of humans believed it had all the answers it needed, except for a few mysteries they assumed would be solved at any moment. And they all believed their ancestors were simplistic and deluded. What are the odds that you are the first generation of humans who will understand reality?

After 3 years, it's on the horizon.  The new JinxBot, and BN#, the managed Battle.net Client library.

Quote from: chyea on January 16, 2009, 05:05 PM
You've just located global warming.

Thing

#16
July 15, 2004, 10:05 PM
QuoteOf course, if you're using Master Pages, you definitely don't need to worry about it -- your graphic designer will worry strictly about the Master Page.  But, the AoA Website (that I haven't kept updated) was done in the ASP.NET 1.0 system.  I got the template from a friend who made it in ImageReady and Photoshop.  I just plugged in the rest.
You might want to consider relaxing your requirements for your visitors in the future.  Why would you want to optimize a site for two specific browsers and only one screen resolution with only one color depth?  I don't have either of those browsers and I don't use that screen resolution or that color depth and it doesn't display correctly.  Also, why would you want to have a special font that nobody has and request that they download it?  Maybe you are a "Windows Only" clan?
That sucking sound you hear is my bandwidth.

quasi-modo

#17
July 15, 2004, 11:29 PM Last Edit: July 15, 2004, 11:30 PM by peofeoknight
who said a thing about optimizing the site to one or two browsers and one resolution? A master template can be accessible... last time I checked my sites will work it ie6, 5.5, 5, mozilla/ns, opera, safari, and even non graphical browsers link lynx. You do not need to do a browser detect to make a page that will go cross platform, and have several pages.
Also if you design for 800 x 600 barely anyone is going to have to deal with a horizontal scroll bar so the site will still look nice, or you could always make a fluid layout that resizes to fit the window's width.
WAR EAGLE!
Quote(00:04:08) zdv17: yeah i quit doing that stuff cause it jacked up the power bill too much
(00:04:19) nick is a turtle: Right now im not paying the power bill though
(00:04:33) nick is a turtle: if i had to pay the electric bill
(00:04:47) nick is a turtle: id hibernate when i go to class
(00:04:57) nick is a turtle: or at least when i go to sleep
(00:08:50) zdv17: hibernating in class is cool.. esp. when you leave a drool puddle

Banana fanna fo fanna

#18
July 15, 2004, 11:39 PM
OT, is there a WYSIWYG CSS designer that renders correctly?

Thing

#19
July 15, 2004, 11:53 PM
peofeoknight, please notice the clever way that I quoted Myndfyre and added a link to a screenshot of the AoA page that he provided.  If you investigate further, you will notice that on the front page of that site, an image provides information on how the site was designed.  No more crack for you.  :)



Quote from: peofeoknight on July 15, 2004, 11:29 PM
who said a thing about optimizing the site to one or two browsers and one resolution? A master template can be accessible... last time I checked my sites will work it ie6, 5.5, 5, mozilla/ns, opera, safari, and even non graphical browsers link lynx. You do not need to do a browser detect to make a page that will go cross platform, and have several pages.
Also if you design for 800 x 600 barely anyone is going to have to deal with a horizontal scroll bar so the site will still look nice, or you could always make a fluid layout that resizes to fit the window's width.
That sucking sound you hear is my bandwidth.

MyndFyre

#20
July 16, 2004, 12:54 AM Last Edit: July 16, 2004, 12:55 AM by Myndfyre
Quote from: Thing on July 15, 2004, 10:05 PM
QuoteOf course, if you're using Master Pages, you definitely don't need to worry about it -- your graphic designer will worry strictly about the Master Page.  But, the AoA Website (that I haven't kept updated) was done in the ASP.NET 1.0 system.  I got the template from a friend who made it in ImageReady and Photoshop.  I just plugged in the rest.
You might want to consider relaxing your requirements for your visitors in the future.  Why would you want to optimize a site for two specific browsers and only one screen resolution with only one color depth?  I don't have either of those browsers and I don't use that screen resolution or that color depth and it doesn't display correctly.  Also, why would you want to have a special font that nobody has and request that they download it?  Maybe you are a "Windows Only" clan?
Yes, we are a "Windows Only" clan.  AoA isn't a programming clan, it's a gaming clan.  The web site serves very effectively for us.  The last time I checked my website's stats, I had only 2 visits from Netscape, and none from any other browser: strictly IE.  That was one of the design decisions when choosing to render the website with an <iframe> object.  People in AoA don't use Linux.  I'm the only one who knows the first thing about programming in the clan.

Quote from: $t0rm on July 15, 2004, 11:39 PM
OT, is there a WYSIWYG CSS designer that renders correctly?
Yes.  The CSS support is quite nice.  :)
QuoteEvery generation of humans believed it had all the answers it needed, except for a few mysteries they assumed would be solved at any moment. And they all believed their ancestors were simplistic and deluded. What are the odds that you are the first generation of humans who will understand reality?

After 3 years, it's on the horizon.  The new JinxBot, and BN#, the managed Battle.net Client library.

Quote from: chyea on January 16, 2009, 05:05 PM
You've just located global warming.

quasi-modo

#21
July 16, 2004, 01:47 AM
dreamweaver has half way decent css support, but nothing beats codeing it by hand.
WAR EAGLE!
Quote(00:04:08) zdv17: yeah i quit doing that stuff cause it jacked up the power bill too much
(00:04:19) nick is a turtle: Right now im not paying the power bill though
(00:04:33) nick is a turtle: if i had to pay the electric bill
(00:04:47) nick is a turtle: id hibernate when i go to class
(00:04:57) nick is a turtle: or at least when i go to sleep
(00:08:50) zdv17: hibernating in class is cool.. esp. when you leave a drool puddle

Grok

#22
July 16, 2004, 06:44 AM
Quote from: peofeoknight on July 16, 2004, 01:47 AM
dreamweaver has half way decent css support, but nothing beats codeing it by hand.

Agreed.  This is a subject you know well, and one of your first posts on our Web Development forum caused me to study CSS in more depth than I had previously.  Having done so, I am usually unhappy with the WYSIWYG designers code output.  Often now, I use the designers to create my prototype and then rewrite the code that generates the HTML/CSS/JavaScript.

Akamas

#23
July 16, 2004, 12:20 PM
I much prefer coding CSS in notepad or using Adobe GoLive.
Quote from: Arta[vL] on August 14, 2006, 04:57 PM
Well, I want some too. Greedy Yoni should stop hogging it.

Banana fanna fo fanna

#24
July 16, 2004, 06:12 PM
What version of GoLive? I've used 6, and I downloaded 7 but I heard it was buggy.

quasi-modo

#25
July 16, 2004, 08:06 PM Last Edit: July 16, 2004, 08:06 PM by peofeoknight
I do all of my hard codeing in dw becuase it has excelent asp.net support. I have not used go live though. How is Go Live compared to Home Site or Dreamweaver?
WAR EAGLE!
Quote(00:04:08) zdv17: yeah i quit doing that stuff cause it jacked up the power bill too much
(00:04:19) nick is a turtle: Right now im not paying the power bill though
(00:04:33) nick is a turtle: if i had to pay the electric bill
(00:04:47) nick is a turtle: id hibernate when i go to class
(00:04:57) nick is a turtle: or at least when i go to sleep
(00:08:50) zdv17: hibernating in class is cool.. esp. when you leave a drool puddle

Banana fanna fo fanna

#26
July 16, 2004, 09:45 PM
GoLive has terrible code editing support, which I believe is where Dreamweaver shines. GoLive is adept at creating CSS layouts though.

quasi-modo

#27
July 16, 2004, 10:48 PM
so its similar to home site then? You used homesite? Its like a light dreamweaver that sucks for scripting in.
WAR EAGLE!
Quote(00:04:08) zdv17: yeah i quit doing that stuff cause it jacked up the power bill too much
(00:04:19) nick is a turtle: Right now im not paying the power bill though
(00:04:33) nick is a turtle: if i had to pay the electric bill
(00:04:47) nick is a turtle: id hibernate when i go to class
(00:04:57) nick is a turtle: or at least when i go to sleep
(00:08:50) zdv17: hibernating in class is cool.. esp. when you leave a drool puddle

Banana fanna fo fanna

#28
July 17, 2004, 12:38 AM
I thought homesite was the other way around...

quasi-modo

#29
July 17, 2004, 12:47 AM Last Edit: July 17, 2004, 12:48 AM by peofeoknight
Its not that great, atleast for asp.net, and I hear its crappy to use for php too. But some people I know that use it use it because they say it is less cluttered then dreamweaver....
WAR EAGLE!
Quote(00:04:08) zdv17: yeah i quit doing that stuff cause it jacked up the power bill too much
(00:04:19) nick is a turtle: Right now im not paying the power bill though
(00:04:33) nick is a turtle: if i had to pay the electric bill
(00:04:47) nick is a turtle: id hibernate when i go to class
(00:04:57) nick is a turtle: or at least when i go to sleep
(00:08:50) zdv17: hibernating in class is cool.. esp. when you leave a drool puddle
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