Valhalla Legends Archive

Note: I use Microsoft products and I develop on the Windows platform.  I am in no way pro-Linux/open-source in the sense.

I've been hearing it over and over again.  New open source projects to emulate Microsoft products.  For instance:
Linux = Windows
Open Office = Microsoft Office
Mono Project = .NET
Linux Development Tools = Visual Studio
etc.

Then I read these articles and reviews about how all these open source projects/products are so much better and cheaper than the ones by Microsoft.  It begins me thinking that as this continues, 10 years down the road is Microsoft even going to exist anymore if people keep thinking this way?  Well, this seems like it'd be possible.  But then I begin to think about how many buisnesses rely on Microsoft and their products, but at the same time with all these new open-source products coming out who's going to need Microsoft.

Anyways, I'm not saying that I think Microsoft will cease to exist in the future, because I honestly think they will thrive as the software giant they have become known as.  But what do you guys all think about this.  Thoughts and opinions? Professional insight (Grok)?

They are showing signs of going into verticals.  I think that's where their next big push will be, as suggested by their talks with SAP.

I think this article has a little bit to do with this thread. I think it shows some of the heat microsoft is feeling.

http://software.silicon.com/os/0,39024651,39121241,00.htm

Also, Grok I'm just wondering what you do for a living since Mephisto specifically asked your profesinal insight

Microsoft is here to stay -- some people _should_ use Windows.  The average computer user (read: idiot) don't even know what "source" means, and will just use whatever's easiest/most common.

iago is right, the average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there... Even with Microsofts focus on improving security and bugs, ect. Eventually unless they crack down, they will keep getting bugs. Linux finds more bugs and exploits in it by a long shot, but its also open source and easier to find them... needless to say every bug found is one less bug in the future and linux keeps getting better for that. But apparently you haven't used Open Office if you think its any comparison to Microsoft Office 2003, or have programmed in vi to put it anywhere near Visual Studio.Net 2003... Theres still a long way to go and the fact is, when something is free there is little to no profit... when there is little to no profit, there is little to no time for that thing. Which most of the programmers for alot of these open source projects are completely doing it as a hobby, in their spare time away from their job or schooling which they -must- do.

Honestly, I don't see it as a problem for Microsoft. Every business/average user I know uses Microsoft and is quite happy (although they do get viruses, which is preventable by microsoft and safe computing), including myself. The only people I see being drawn to linux and open source are hardcore computer users, not gamers, and programmers, not kids and the elderly.

From what I've read about that "safe computing" (or whatever, forget what it's called already), they are beginning to lock the market.

Quote from: j0k3r on June 12, 2004, 06:14 AM
Honestly, I don't see it as a problem for Microsoft. Every business/average user I know uses Microsoft and is quite happy (although they do get viruses, which is preventable by microsoft and safe computing), including myself. The only people I see being drawn to linux and open source are hardcore computer users, not gamers, and programmers, not kids and the elderly.

From what I've read about that "safe computing" (or whatever, forget what it's called already), they are beginning to lock the market.

i do, because people are seeing the greed... when you buy lets say XP you cant use the same key twice nor can you put the same on another computer... if you wanted to network 3 or 4 computeres and all you had was one verson of XP then thats going to cost alot of money.

Quote from: GoSuGaMING on June 12, 2004, 08:36 AM
i do, because people are seeing the greed... when you buy lets say XP you cant use the same key twice nor can you put the same on another computer... if you wanted to network 3 or 4 computeres and all you had was one verson of XP then thats going to cost alot of money.

And you bought windows intending to install it on all your computers? Tell me, do you buy insurance and use it for all your cars, or do you get insurance on each car? Do you pay for a house and take all the houses you want or do you pay for one house and live in it?

What would keep you from using your multi-purpose cdkey on others computers? One person would have to buy a cdkey and everyone could use that, Microsoft spends millions developing this great software and then make $250 off it?

Quote from: Hostile on June 12, 2004, 03:52 AM
iago is right, the average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there... Even with Microsofts focus on improving security and bugs, ect. Eventually unless they crack down, they will keep getting bugs. Linux finds more bugs and exploits in it by a long shot, but its also open source and easier to find them... needless to say every bug found is one less bug in the future and linux keeps getting better for that. But apparently you haven't used Open Office if you think its any comparison to Microsoft Office 2003, or have programmed in vi to put it anywhere near Visual Studio.Net 2003... Theres still a long way to go and the fact is, when something is free there is little to no profit... when there is little to no profit, there is little to no time for that thing. Which most of the programmers for alot of these open source projects are completely doing it as a hobby, in their spare time away from their job or schooling which they -must- do.

You obviously haven't used vi correctly.  The only thing I miss is the autocomplete.  

Quotethe average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there

You can do anything and more on Linux.  The difference is, Windows makes it easier.  On Linux, it's harder to get it going, but generally more powerful, free, and open source.

Linux is having some problems altogether right now anyway. A lot of business who would even think of using linux right now would wait for the SCO crap to settle down first anyway. And the trial got delayed again.

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1611192,00.asp

Quote from: iago on June 12, 2004, 11:55 AM

Quotethe average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there

You can do anything and more on Linux.  The difference is, Windows makes it easier.  On Linux, it's harder to get it going, but generally more powerful, free, and open source.

But most computer users don't need power.  They need ability.  I'm not willing to dick around for hours upon hours on end just to get the computer to work exactly the way I want it, when I can do so in about 2 (granted, because I'm familiar with it) on Windows.  Most computer users also don't need open source.

What is America all about?  We're willing to pay more for more convenience.  That's why Microsoft is dominant and Linux isn't catching on, despite the hype.

Quote from: muert0 on June 12, 2004, 02:10 PM
Linux is having some problems altogether right now anyway. A lot of business who would even think of using linux right now would wait for the SCO crap to settle down first anyway. And the trial got delayed again.

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1611192,00.asp

SCO is doomed!  I keep up with the progress of it's jihad on a daily basis.  Smart business owners and investors know that they (SCO) are destined for destruction.  They collected 11K from their pursuit of license fees, most all of which came from EV1.  Even when "analysts" suggested that EV1's business would drop because of SCO, it continues to grow, while SCO stock continues to slide.  More detailed  information can be found at this site.

Here's a handy stock tip:
Don't buy SCO stock unless you like losing money.  Your Welcome.

Quote from: Myndfyre on June 12, 2004, 04:26 PM

Quote from: iago on June 12, 2004, 11:55 AM

Quotethe average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there

You can do anything and more on Linux.  The difference is, Windows makes it easier.  On Linux, it's harder to get it going, but generally more powerful, free, and open source.

But most computer users don't need power.  They need ability.

Yes, and Linux has considerably more ability.

As a small example, Linux can read Windows' filesystems (Fat32, NTFS), but Windows can't read Linux's (ext2/ext3/ReiserFS).  

Plus, anything I can do on Windows, I can do better and cheaper on Linux.  It takes a little getting used to, but once you're good with Linux it's hard to go back.

Maybe Bill Gates should quit MS now while he's ahead (You know, with his billions of dollars)

Quote from: iago on June 12, 2004, 07:58 PM

Quote from: Myndfyre on June 12, 2004, 04:26 PM

Quote from: iago on June 12, 2004, 11:55 AM

Quotethe average computer user will use whatever he can do everything he wants to do on. Linux isn't close to this and Windows is already there

You can do anything and more on Linux.  The difference is, Windows makes it easier.  On Linux, it's harder to get it going, but generally more powerful, free, and open source.

But most computer users don't need power.  They need ability.

Yes, and Linux has considerably more ability.

As a small example, Linux can read Windows' filesystems (Fat32, NTFS), but Windows can't read Linux's (ext2/ext3/ReiserFS).  

Plus, anything I can do on Windows, I can do better and cheaper on Linux.  It takes a little getting used to, but once you're good with Linux it's hard to go back.

Linux can reads Microsoft's file systems (even though I've heard otherwise) because Linux needed to fight against Microsoft, so they just conformed to being able to read their file systems.  Microsoft really never had a need to do that...Linux is basically fighting the uphill battle getting the edge on Microsoft as much as they can while Microsoft defends is the way I see it.